Larry Carrico was presented with a unique opportunity early in his career to take over a rent-to-own business deep in the south. From that one location, he’s been able to grow Rent One into a massively successful multi-state, 100-store operation. Larry shares his story, talks about the importance of finding the right people (and caring for them) and their foray into giving back.

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Rob Stott: All right. We are back on the Independent Thinking Podcast and diving into the world of rent to own right now with Larry Carrico, founder of Rent One. Appreciate you joining us for a podcast today.

Larry Carrico: Yeah, well thanks. Appreciate the opportunity. You guys have been great to us. We had some great things that went on to allow us to be able to help some of the charities and one of them in particular, Ronald McDonald House.

Rob Stott: Yeah.

Larry Carrico: They’re all over the world as far as that goes, but they were very instrumental in getting us the ability to help them out, so it was cool.

Rob Stott: Absolutely. No excited to dive into that with you, but I know we got a long list of stuff, a history to dive into with you guys. But before we even get to that, I know you mentioned it before we hopped on, and this was news to me as we sat here, is you guys got a podcast too. So tell me about that. You’re like an expert, you’re a pro at this, is that what I understand?

Larry Carrico: No, no, no. My daughter’s the pro at it. I just listen. I join every once in a while, but we have a platform that we do internally with the company called Haystack, and of course these are posted on YouTube. But it allows us to share fun times. They’re usually anywhere between 25, 35 minutes and talks about ways of doing better business and keeping the coworkers engaged is really what it’s about. We get a great response. We got 600, 700 employees, so we’ll get 50, a hundred sometimes just on there listening and of course they record afterwards, so it’s a lot of fun.

Rob Stott: Absolutely. And that’s one of those things too. We started this for the member stories. We have so many members and being able to tell their stories, and we’ve obviously talked to our own staff on it as well, and vendor partners as well. So it’s always unique to hear… One of the unintended benefits of it is that our employees, as we Nationwide’s grown over the last few years, they use it as almost onboarding. Listening to all of the things about who Nationwide is if they’re not familiar when they join what Nationwide does and who our members are. So it’s cool that something like this where it’s just conversations between a couple of people has more benefits to it than what you guys set out to do with it initially. But I love that you guys have one and that employees are using it and it’s a way to stay reengaged.

Larry Carrico: Well and the world kind of changed with COVID and stuff, so the communication levels became in a virtual spot where you weren’t able to connect with people as much, and so they’re used to doing this as this kind of almost a must. And it allowed us to share information back and forth about what we do every day. And people want to work for people that they know what’s happening and podcast helps that. Of course, the book and things like that that we’ve created over the years really makes a big difference for people in engagement and the success of Rent One.

Rob Stott: Yeah, absolutely. And it goes to proof too. You don’t need to have a Jason Kelce, Travis Kelce esque podcast to have it be successful. You can have just a couple hundred listeners and its intended purpose is fulfilled. So no, I love to hear that. And hey, one podcast, even if you’re only on it every once in a while, you’re still a podcaster because you’ve done it. So one podcaster to another, happy to have you on and dive into the Rent One story today.

Larry Carrico: Yeah, cool.

Rob Stott: Awesome. Well, let’s start there. I know this should be easy for you because you guys just got done writing a book about it. But let’s dive into the history of Rent One and tell us what those early days were like. 1985, is that right?

Larry Carrico: Yep, yep. Started back in 1985, I started my journey in the shoe business.

Rob Stott: Okay, yeah.

Larry Carrico: So I worked for a company called Florsheim. Learned a lot of management stuff, and then I got into the rent to own business, actually about 1981 with another company. Worked for them for about four years, and then they decided, well, we have some stores down in Muscle Shoals, Alabama and Huntsville, Alabama. They said, “Larry, would you like to purchase those?” And I said, “Well, I don’t really have any money. You guys don’t pay me enough, so how am I going to do that?” You know how that goes. Humble beginnings, we was able to scrape together enough money to get… And back in those days, it was like the Transamerica as the finance people weren’t banks, so rent to own was not seen as a mainstream place where banks wanted to loan money, so you had to go to these guys that were charging you 5% over prime. And at that time, prime was probably in the 13%… Well actually at one time it was 18%, so you’re paying 23% interest, so people are moaning about 5.5% or 7.5% or 8%.

But anyway, we made the purchase and mostly shuttles, Alabama, we had two stores. And from there we just kind of grew it. Basically the same thing we’re talking about was with people. You can’t do anything without great team members. And so we had one store in Muscle Shoals and one in Huntsville. We sold the one in Huntsville because it was adversity. You had to go back and forth all the time. So I had this one store. Anyway, I paid back the lenders or paid most of it back and they said, “Hey, we like it.” And so I bought the rest of the company. So the company that I worked for were struggling, and what I was able to do was to purchase the… I bought different levels of it, 10, five, seven, eight, 10 stores at that time, and then we just grew from two to over a hundred now. And it’s not a lot when you look at 30 years or 35 years. See ’85… Oh hell, almost 40 years.

Rob Stott: Right? Some growth right there. But I love the no matter whether it’s traditional, independent retail, rent or own the origin stories. Was this something, back to your shoe shop, was this something you thought you’d get into? Was this the plan or did you kind of fall into the world of rent to own?

Larry Carrico: Well, actually, I became unemployed with the Florsheim shoe company.

Rob Stott: Wow.

Larry Carrico: Again they said, “Well, we like you, Larry, but…” There’s a whole story behind that. But anyway, I moved back to St. Louis and I answered an interview and they said, “Hey, we’ve got this manager trainee position for you. You’ve got a lot of…” And hell, I was a general manager. I ran a $4.5 million business in California for them, so I had a lot of experience. However, I didn’t know nothing. I didn’t know what the hell rent to own was about.

So anyway, they put me in, they called me an MIT and paid me four bucks an hour. I was making more on unemployment from California than I was hourly to drive to a place to work. But anyway, that’s kind of how I got started. I became an MIT and eventually fairly quickly and within a couple months I was a store manager and advanced through the ranks with them. And then again they said, “Hey, we got this couple stores down in Alabama doing very well. You want to buy them?” Like, “What the hell I want to buy them? I ain’t got any money.” I was the one that opened them up, and that’s kind of how it worked, but it was a different thing.

Rob Stott: No, that’s awesome. Well, to grow to what it is today. We’ll talk about the growth in a little bit, but kind of paint the picture of what the business is like today. You mentioned a hundred stores, several states. Almost 10? More than 10?

Larry Carrico: We’re in eight states.

Rob Stott: Eight, okay.

Larry Carrico: Yeah. So I mean, it was hard because it was just myself and my wife.

Rob Stott: Yeah, it’s crazy.

Larry Carrico: We weren’t doing any revenue. So back then it wasn’t like stores were doing a million dollars. We had stores were doing a couple hundred thousand dollars, but we built it and we had trusted advisors, we had great vendors. And really our uniqueness was that we always believed in paying people back. And that kind of got to the point where we continued to grow and of course, vendors want to sell you, people want to lease to you and stuff like that. And it was just my wife and I, we had one kid, we had Steven, he’s my oldest son. And then we had a daughter, so I had three kids in three states, so I quit moving. So I figured out what the problem was. I kept moving.

Rob Stott: Stay still.

Larry Carrico: Well, Steve was born in Missouri, Nikki was born in Alabama, and then Kelly was born in Illinois. But it was just her and I, we had this shitty apartment that was in… Oh man, it was terrible. It was in Florence, Alabama had holes in the walls from the last guys that rented it, but we made it. My wife worked side by side, her and I. Just kept renting, collecting and protecting. That’s how we talk about it and run it down.

Rob Stott: That’s awesome. No, that’s incredible. And what did you learn about that? I mean, obviously getting involved in it and being able to have some experience in it before you go out and own, you get to learn a lot. But not known what rent to own was until now, where you are today, what did you learn along the way about this business?

Larry Carrico: Yeah, well, there’s two things. I didn’t know anything when I first got into it, but I did know that the concept was cool because you were providing cold milk, clean clothes, good night’s sleep, whatever. And we kind of immediately, not really immediately, but after a few years we figured out we weren’t selling washers and dryers, we were selling clean clothes. And when we found out that there was a matching need that made a big difference. And so that’s kind of how it worked and it’s just an alternative to financing. We had early payouts. And the big journey was over the years was understanding that you got to get better.

So when it first started, there was no disclosures. It was like the Wild, Wild West. You were on Bonanza or something back in the early days. I mean, people just did all kinds of crazy stuff. But as long as you respected people, you collected properly and did all those things, you were successful. But it was quite the challenge because I didn’t know anything about it. And then I found the mistakes. It was a learning experience from ’81 to ’85 before I owned the business because the people that were there were struggling and one of the reasons where we were… They were moving the ball a little bit and stuff, and it made it really difficult. I bought and sold probably a hundred stores during that four year period. So I knew how to open them, I knew how to close them and I knew how to sell them.

Rob Stott: No, that’s awesome.

Larry Carrico: That was kind of important.

Rob Stott: Well, and then too, you mentioned the people obviously having a focus on, I imagine building strong teams that are bought into a company culture and want to grow with you. So what along the way to get to a hundred stores today do you think it was that helped you to get to that, to where you’re today?

Larry Carrico: Well, I think there was a couple of things. Number one was the ability to understand the financing part of it. How do you grow the business, how do you do that? But number two, which is probably even more important was the people, like you said. So the Zig Ziglars of the world, the Dale Carnegie’s. We always look for outside training and that’s one of the things that we’re continuing to do today. So being able to understand, have great team members. And it comes and goes, and we still have guys that have been working for me from day one and we have five or six of them. Just had a guy retire that was actually buys from you guys to his… Well, from RentDirect and Nationwide over the years. So it kind of changed, but that’s exactly how it worked was the people and then being able to make sure that you were a trusted to borrow the money or to pay the money back. And that was the two things that got us to where we were at today.

Rob Stott: Gotcha. What about obviously retail and rent to own technologies that are support and are around this business evolve. Obviously it doesn’t look the same today as it did in 1985, but as far as the heart of the business, has that changed at all?

Larry Carrico: Well, technology. So now the ability to really manage the stores on a different level. So in St. Louis, at one time we purchased some stores from one of the dealers in St. Louis and there was like 16, 18 stores in the city of St. Louis. Now you can operate with six or eight because of two things. One is auto pay and the ability to people to pay online and shop online. So we were one of the first, if not the first, people that actually had a website. We did online payments.

So I created, through our marketing company, my wife did as well, is developers that created online payment systems and shopping networks. So we were able to drop things into a market because our customers, they were trying to understand the client and they thought they were different than the retail. They’re not. The only difference is they don’t want to have debt and they return it if they don’t want to. But two, they want to have ownership. And that’s what ended up happening is that we had a lot of advancements, whether it’s websites, all the marketing strategies that we have now are incredible to be able to chase clients around and get them to put stuff in the cart and then actually check out. So we watch conversions and all that stuff, which you guys do a great job of too in your marketing team.

Rob Stott: No, we try. For sure. So it’s interesting to hear you talk about a lot of those same challenges and the way you have to approach business and go find customers. So today, what are some of the big, I don’t want to call them pain points, but the areas where you’re looking to improve or are there challenges today? What are you facing as a rent to own business in 2024?

Larry Carrico: Well, I think it still goes back to the people. Since we will monitor turnover, we have a department that does that. We have a culture and strategy department. My daughter was part of that right there. Luckily we did it in 2019. So it really is still the number one challenge is people. So what I tried to develop with our hiring process was the same as we do in marketing. So first off, it’s got to be quick, it’s got to be easy. They got to get the information they want and we got to get the rental order filled. In rent to own, you got to get the rental order filled and put them in the cart and get them to check out.

Same thing happens in actually the hiring of people. It can’t be a long lengthy thing. You can’t click nine buttons. I mean, we’ve got to be engaged with them within minutes. So I have a hiring of people. So I have our own recruiters. We have our own platform, it’s called ITN. It allows us to ask certain questions. We know the success rates. And just like the marketing that you were talking about, the challenge is you got to use the dynamics of what goes on, the statistical numbers to say, “If I get a hundred people and I’m successful with 10 of them, is that good?” I’d rather have 50 and have 20. And sometimes you think more is better, but in reality more has to be quality. And it’s no different than the checkout process and the carts, just like the retailers do too. You have to monitor that.

And we always say, you got to get better or get out. And it’s always about constantly. I think that’s some of the things that we’ve done over the years, whether it’s online payments, wireless internet, I had RadioShacks. We always talk about failure as an event, not a person. Because we had a lot of failures. I can name all the businesses that went along. New to you, all kinds of businesses that went along, but then we had a company called Proof Wireless. Well, that was an internet business, but Verizon said, “Hey, we’re bigger, better than you are.” And they ended up stomping us down. So that continually advancement and change is what has to happen.

Rob Stott: No, that’s awesome. And I think an important message too for no matter what type of business, rent to own or retail to hear that kind of message delivered. Speaking of messaging and delivering. On the marketing side, do you guys approach the way you talk about your business any differently than a traditional retailer? Obviously in the way customers interact with you, it’s different than traditional retail. So is the marketing different at all in sort of the way you message about your business?

Larry Carrico: Well, it’s about ownership. We’re not rent to rent, we’re rent to own.

Rob Stott: Sure. Yep.

Larry Carrico: So I mean people still want to own it, not that everybody does, but they want choices. So the difference in the message that you can return it at any time, you have no long-term obligation. We take care of everything. So with our clients, we’re in the tire and wheel business too, they need a way to work. So I think our difference in our retail business opposed to the rent to own, we think of the benefits. We think of cold milk as a refrigerator. Why do we do so much business in bedding? Well, there’s two reasons. Number one is that it’s a great night’s sleep. So if you sleep better, you’re going to perform better. Yeah, if you perform better, you can get a raise. Yeah. So we have different angles at the way that we sell.

But number two on the process that we have is that there’s no hiccups. So you got to remember if there’s a hiccup, I have real people. I have client retention specialists that work just like an AT&T or try to disconnect your service. Well, we try to work on the same type of process because of the benefits. And that’s really the difference in retail and rent to own is that we get it back. So I mean, if they decide to bring it back, retail, hey, they sell it one time, you’re a price. So we’re a cost. We don’t necessarily watch the price. We watch the cost and the cost is they don’t want to have any hiccups. If they do, they got to bring it back. But if they do, that’s fine. But we have reinstatement rights. I mean, where can you buy something, return it, and they give you the money that you just paid in six months ago on another refrigerator? That doesn’t happen. So our thing’s all about the ownership. That’s really the difference is between those two or three things that the difference between retail and rent to own.

Rob Stott: And you guys do end to end service as well. So from the entire experience for that customer is sort of taken care of. The second they sign that contract with you for whatever the deal is with the product that they’re getting, and then you got it from there, it’s delivery, install service throughout all that?

Larry Carrico: Yeah. And so that’s kind of the difference. You have to be able to explain when we still give them a cash price, a retail price and stuff, it’s $899. It might be 1200 bucks on a rent-to-own program. But along the other way is that you’re paying me weekly, you’re paying me monthly, however it is, but you also have that ability to still pay that $899 at any time. And in the rent to own program, we actually give you 50% of whatever you pay in against the retail price.

So it is kind of a good thing for the clients. And that’s the biggest difference from end to end, like you said, because you can’t have a hiccup. So if a guy loses his job, you got to work that out. But they can talk to a trusted advisor versus a call center after the 30 days past due. So the trick is not to allow the customer to get too far out of balance. Because if they do, they can’t make it up and then somebody has a problem, they either want to return it, they feel bad. I mean they really do. Their thing is, “I want to own it, Mr. Carrico. I want to own it.”

Rob Stott: No, that’s incredible. So I feel like I might know this answer because it might go back to talk about growth and what the important areas of focus were there. But so talk about this year, 2024. Economy wise, it impacts us all. We hear about everything going on and people are following it. But what’s the big area of focus for you this year in terms of are you looking to grow, looking to improve? What are those points of focus for Rent One?

Larry Carrico: I mean all the rent to own and all the retails, we all think we got the best program, we got the best people, we had the best programs for our people. But we’ve learned over the years, so like I said, I had a lot of failures. So I had the RadioShacks and all kinds of different things that somebody else beat me out of.

So what we’ve done this year, and in the years past too as well, but we’ve taken our trusted advisors, there’s a guy named Robert Teschler, so he’s a F-16 pilot. So he was the one who actually teaches our clients at our top level. We have three levels. We have the big top performers, then you got the guys in the middle that need some leadership skills, and then you got the guys on the bottom, the managers that are up and comers, they need to know sales. So we’ve engaged with cohort one, which is Robert Teschler. We engage with those folks to train our top leaders to get better.

Number two, the middle people is the leadership. They got to rent, collect, protect, they got to service the product, they got to hire people. I mean, they have a list. It’s not like when you got to have this return part and you got to take care of the service part, retailers don’t have that same thing. So we’re working really hard on the leadership side. And that’s our middle group. And that middle group is done by a company called ITN, and that’s the people who do our training and our onboarding of our people and stuff.

And then finally the number three division, those starting people that are lower in potential revenue, we’re using those people with Dale Carnegie. So you’ve heard of Dale Carnegie over the years. And so whenever I first got started in the business, one of the unique things was I didn’t know… I mean, I knew business, I knew a little bit. I always went to outside sources. So Zig Ziglar, train the trainer and Dale Carnegie were the two things that if you went to me as a manager, if you looked at my most successful people, they had either one of two… They had two things. One, they had Zig Ziglar training, “See you over the top,” “You can have everything you want in life if you help other people get what they want.”

And then you had Dale Carnegie, he was How to Win Friends and Influence People. Those folks, Carnegie number one, not only did they help the business, which is important, but they helped the family lives of the people. So the people that are still sitting in the company at top positions, they went through Dale Carnegie 30 years ago. And we’re still using Dale Carnegie. So some things just don’t wear out. But those really are the three things that we’re focusing on this year to get our bottom to our middle, our middle to our top, and our top over the top. So those are the things that we’re at right now. That’s the challenge for this year.

Rob Stott: No, I love it. And again, too, like I said, it goes back to the people, which I knew. I had a feeling that’s where it was. And it’s awesome to hear that because at the end of the day, your business is your people. And what they put out is as far as whether it’s effort, expertise, whatever it might be, that’s at the end of the day, what’s going to impact Rent One and what you guys are doing. So to see that that focus is on them and helping them improve is exciting to hear for sure.

Larry Carrico: We used to say it’s the man, not the land, but it’s the people not the place. So I have beautiful stores, I have remodel, we’ve written up different catalogs and books and stuff. But in reality, I can have the greatest look in store, but if I have the wrong people behind the counter, I can bring them in. But if the people are not correct, it doesn’t matter. And then I’ve seen the other one, I go to maybe a competitor and he’s kicking my butt. He’s got holes in his carpet, he’s got something else. The TV’s only got nine TVs on the shelf and I got 20. It doesn’t matter. People buy from people. And same thing with retail. I can tell you that your most successful retailers are the guys who have, they have tenure, they’ve been here for five, six, seven. Turnover is the killer, but how do you do that in today’s age? It’s been pretty tough.

Rob Stott: Sure has been. That might be a whole nother episode.

Larry Carrico: Exactly.

Rob Stott: I wanted to close it on this important topic because it goes back to people and examples are set from the top. And I think some of the recent things you guys have been doing, as far as the foundation’s concerned and Great Expectations Foundation, sets a great example for your people to see sort of the way you guys have been given back of late. And I know one story, we’ll dive into it in the specific story with Ronald McDonald House. But talk about those give back efforts and the nexus for them and how they come about and why it’s important to you as a business owner to take this approach and do something to give back.

Larry Carrico: So when you think about giving tithing, whatever, you don’t even realize how it starts. But I guess you remember when you were a kid, what happened. So mom and dad, mom worked at the concession stand at the quarter league field. Dad took care of the fields, but I didn’t think much about that until I got older. And then I began to kind of work things in. I kind of went from there and didn’t really think much about tithing. It was just being able to pay the bills.

And when I moved to Mount Vernon from Muscle Shoals when we bought some stores in Mount Vernon, Illinois, and that began our corporate headquarters, someone asked, and this was probably the most important thing, and I’ll say today, is that you got to ask people if you want them to help. And the Kiwanians, of all groups. You got the Rotary, the Kiwanians, the Lions, all these guys. They asked me to talk about my business, but I talked about my business. Well, there was an ulterior motive. One was, hey, they did want to hear about my business, but they needed workers. So not only did I start in the, we call it… You give away a treasure and you give away those three things, the time treasures. And what ended up happening was that I gave away a lot of my time doing things. Of course, you’re always looking for the treasure and how do you get to that particular point that you got to ask? And so that started that. We began the whole process.

And then Ronald McDonald House, the reason we teamed up and partnered with them was we were on all the parameters of St. Louis. And what we kept asking our coworkers was, “Why are you going there?” And I called a guy named Dan Harbaugh and said, “Hey, we can help him out at the House.” And that’s because they were on the outside. They weren’t charities in my individual communities.

But Great Expectation began and started for two reasons. Number one was because we wanted a concise way of doing it. But number two is that we match everybody’s money. So what starts the whole thing is we ask people to raise their hand. I said, “Look, you want to help?” And they did. They give a buck a week. We do it all out of payroll deduct. And then Sharon and I, my wife matches that dollar. And then the companies, whether it’s RNR or Rent One, we match it. So every dollar they give you get a $3 bill that goes to the charity of choice. And now we do it in all a hundred communities that we have based upon need.

Rob Stott: Yeah, that’s awesome. That’s incredible stuff. And I know Nationwide has its own give back efforts, and it’s exciting to see, especially a show like Primetime where I know in the past we’ve had the meal packings, and to watch everyone come together and take part in that and knowing the impact it has, it does a lot to the people. Again, it comes back to the people and seeing that impact that you can have. And I know just what that can do to a culture within a company as well and the importance there. So it really kind of ties everything back together in a nice way. And you mentioned Ronald McDonald House, you guys just recently too, I know you got together with our own John Laing here at Nationwide and the team at LG. So talk about that and what was behind those efforts?

Larry Carrico: Well, actually when we first got invited again, we got to remember to ask. So kids went to school, where they went to school is one of the guys was there, he is a banker. And he said, “Larry, we have a need at Ronald McDonald House. We have these new family rooms, these long-term apartments that need TVs. Would you be willing to donate them?” So I donated those TVs. That’s how they hooked me in. So it’s kind of strange that after 25 years that I’ve been working with Ronald McDonald House is now we’re doing their brand new house.

Rob Stott: That’s awesome.

Larry Carrico: $34 million project.

Rob Stott: Wow.

Larry Carrico: And we’re supplying all the TVs for them, with the help of you guys too as well, which is incredible. So it started with TVs. I hope it’s not ending with TVs, but it’s that continuation or that journey.

Rob Stott: Right. This is not a full circle moment here. It’s just like we’re continuing, the line is going on, it just happens to… No, it’s a nice way to bring it all back around again.

Larry Carrico: Yeah. I was thinking about that and I said, “Oh, this is incredible.”

Rob Stott: No, that is. And it is. And I know, obviously I’m sure they appreciate the efforts and everything that it means to them. And then of course too, the team at Rent One sees it, and I’m sure it impacts them as well in a way that some might tell you some, it’ll just be one of those things they realize and it’s like, man, that’s just cool to be a part of. To be a part of the team that’s doing this. And who would’ve thought back in 1985 with one store down there in Alabama, that this is what it is today.

Larry Carrico: And the last thing, one of the things to talk about would be making sure that people share the information. So, if they weren’t, it wouldn’t do any good to do all this. And people are kind of both ways. They want to be anonymous, some don’t. But I really do believe that it sparks other people to donate because it’s making good… Just like the podcast we’re doing today and all the other things that we do, we want to make sure that we tell our friends and our coworkers especially.

Rob Stott: Absolutely. Well, hey, and if we can play one small part in that and helping share that story, more than happy to do so and appreciate you having the opportunity or giving us that opportunity and having the time to do it. So we really appreciate it and I look forward to catching up again. This was a lot of fun.

Larry Carrico: Yeah, I’d love to. Tell John we appreciate him and the whole team over there as well.

Rob Stott: Hey, maybe we’ll do a little podcast crossover. What do you think?

Larry Carrico: Well, maybe we’ll have you on our podcast. You’ll get my daughter Kelly. Gosh, it’s fun. Her and Dusty get on the thing and they just go crazy. I mean, they have a great time. So it could be a follow up after we load all these TVs.

Rob Stott: I am all for it. No, that’s fantastic. So we appreciate the time and like I said, look forward to doing it again soon.

Larry Carrico: All right man. Thanks, Ron. Appreciate you. Thanks.